Guru Wars comics Published on June 11th, 2010 | by Harmonist staff 11 Share this:FacebookLike this:Like Loading... About the Author Harmonist staff Related Posts Sadhu-sanga → “Normal Life” → The Qualities of a Devotee → Bucket List → 11 Responses to Guru Wars Bhaktikanda June 11, 2010 at 9:12 am Uh, a guru with Isvara-bhava is himself no quite in Vraja, right? Reply Gurunistha dasa June 11, 2010 at 11:14 pm That’s part of the joke. Misconceptions boosted up with arrogance. Besides, you can fall from Goloka, right? 😉 Reply Citta Hari dasa June 11, 2010 at 12:17 pm This is great–totally catches the spirit of much of the sentiment in Gaudiya Vaisnavism these days. Reply atmananda June 11, 2010 at 12:32 pm nice…. I especially like the temples made of sand. Sad, but true and somehow simultaneously humurous :/ Reply Gopakumar das June 11, 2010 at 7:11 pm Maybe they are both deep in sakhya bhava and are expressing the heroic wish that their group leader will conquer the other’s in a forest fight; kick their butt right out of the Vraj! Wishful thinking? Then maybe the tradition –in its wish to cultivate love for a god whose godhood is concealed– attracts sadhakas who have a propensity for envy? I mean, maybe some sadhakas are less attracted to the intimacy this egalitarianism affords and more motivated by serving a god whose godhood does not have to be confronted. No overt godhood, no need to envy. They then find themselves in a tradition wherein their is hierarchy, power differentials, knowledge differences, and spiritual advancement differences and WHAM! Envious onslaught! Envy is a tough thing to deal with! I lied down on a couch 4 times a week for 4 years to eradicate (or at least significantly lessen) my own! Reply Mohini Dasi June 11, 2010 at 11:13 pm Very interesting…Jagat Guru,sandcastles etc… Reply KB das June 12, 2010 at 1:51 am Very interesting too…. http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/05-10/editorials6139.htm Reply Gurunistha dasa June 12, 2010 at 1:04 pm That’s crazy, I had never seen that article until now! Don’t worry KB, I didn’t intentionally violate your copy right. Reply Gopakumar das June 12, 2010 at 11:57 am Thanks KB. The issue of the fall of the Jiva does often seem like an ISKCON phenomena and reason for guru-wars, but I would extend that to say it is a Western Gaudiya phenomena (as many Western Gaudiyas take a position in the debate). I think one reason is the blurring or Judeo-Christian theology on original sin and the Fall with Vedantic theology. However, something else also comes to me when I contemplate this. In the question of, “Did we fall away from God?” I always find a curious undercurrent. That undercurrent is another, emotional question, “Did I do something wrong?” or “Is there something wrong with me?” The alternative to ‘the fall’ would be that we were intended to be distinct and separate in some way from God, possibly to foster some longing. Another possibility is that we have never had direct contact with the divine, having been created as separate entities. Regardless of all of these possibilities, the common denominator is the reality of our separation from God. The atheists would say we experience separation because we are grasping for contact with an illusion. However, this possibility aside, regardless of the reason for separation, it is the separation that is the dilemma. I wonder if ISKCON members in particular –feeling significantly cut-off from the rest of the Gaudiya community– are feeling extra separation? Or –experiencing themselves as cut-off from the mystical emphasis of Gaudiya Vedanta– feel the separation as too great to manage? As a result of these alienations, there may be an inordinate preoccupation with the reason for the separation, all the while ignoring the ways in which separation might be remedied; separation from the greater community of Vaisnavas and thereby opening the way to Krishna himself. Reply Citta Hari dasa June 12, 2010 at 6:52 pm But then of course Mahaprabhu is known as vipralambha-murti, the embodiment of separation. He shows us that separation itself is the way to Krsna. Reply Gopakumar das June 13, 2010 at 2:11 am There is a difference between separation as an experience of divine sentiment or withdraw of divine contact and the separation based in materialistic, prejudiced, and self-interested motivations. Reply Leave a Reply Cancel replyYour email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *Comment Name * Email * Website Notify me of followup comments via e-mail. You can also subscribe without commenting.