Published on August 2nd, 2012 | by Gurunistha5
Animals Off the Menu
Published on August 2nd, 2012 | by Gurunistha5
Excerpts from classical Gaudiya texts, with and without commentaries, hosted by teachers with whom readers can interact and ask questions.
News from around the world with an emphasis on alternative press that is especially relevant to spiritual practitioners.
Philosophical articles on Gaudiya Vaisnavism that focus on the tradition's scriptural conclusions as well as its feeling for the nature of ultimate reality.
© 2022 Sri Caitanya Sangha
It is truly wonderful, truly gratifying, when a person who is relatively powerful, charismatic, a natural leader amongst human beings takes a passionate stand on an issue like this.
Krishna says in Gita that whatever position the great personalities take, the common people follow in their footsteps. That is just how society works.
There seems to be so many powerful charismatic people that are self-centered, even to the point of being corrupt, immoral, etc. And so society follows suit. And our full jails are simply the reflection of the criminal mentality of those who run our governments and multi-national corporations.
Of course if we become pure devotees…….. we may be able to surpass our material limitations, and have a wonderful impact, really be able to render a service to humanity – to all living beings.
The issues discussed by this speaker are simple and clear. People can’t hear it if they refuse to hear it. Srila Prabhupada used to say that you can’t wake someone who is pretending to be asleep. But imagine if the presidents of the various nations went on TV in their respective countries and spoke in this way.
Well, this is planet earth, of course. This is the material world. We recently had a house guest who refused to hear that the material world is not a nice place. Some people (some devtees also, I think) like to keep a “positive” attitude and see the world as a beautiful place. My father was a butcher. And I’ve been to a slaughterhouse. Keeping a smile on our face and refusing to know won’t change what’s going on there.
Bottom line. Get qualified so that we don’t have to come back. Then perhaps we will be qualified to help others get out.
The entire debate. The good thing is that both sides agreed that factory farming is to be stopped for the most part. Obviously, the speaker is too emotive at some moments. Singer obviously is the most seasoned of all and his ending is pretty good as usual.
I meant Phillip Wollen when I said the speaker got very emotive. He feels there is not distinction between factory farming and other kinds of meat, which I feel is a very black and white view of the issue. Singer on the hand says he will like the shift from factory farming to ethical animal production, but then the animal production would be much smaller and literally it will be off the menu automatically. Singer to me is the most seasoned of the people. Though, he does say that bacteria don’t possess consciousness, so the other people won’t agree 🙂 with that.
“He feels there is not distinction between factory farming and other kinds of meat, which I feel is a very black and white view of the issue.”
Of course it is preferable to minimize the suffering of these souls in animal bodies. But murder is murder and our scriptures forcefully oppose it up to the point of capital punishment. Maharaja Parikshit drew his sword and was preparing to kill the personality of Kali. Not that we are advised to take this up under the circumstances.
As far as bacteria are concerned, we have to protect and maintain our bodies, whether bacteria are consious or not. We are not advised to lie down and allow staph infections to go systemic (unless we are overwhelmed with feelings of ecstatic love for these invaders.) So in this case our choices are restricted.
But the term “ethical animal production” is a misnomer as long as the goal is to slaughter these creatures. Just as there is no such thing as “ethical slavery”, “ethical child prostitution”. There is nothing ethical about it.
Guess I have some emotional issues over all of this, as I tend to empathize and identify with the animals due to my victim mentality. Hard for me, at times to sort all that out.
One of the issues that has not been mentioned is the assertion that the karmic effect of animal slaughter for meat consumption is war between human groups. Although I cannot quote the source, I beieve that Srila Prabhupada makes that point.
It would be interesting therefore to do a study wherein the question is put o meat eaters and non-meat eaters as to whether they would be willing to engage in war and under what conditions.
For example the web informs us that in the U.S. invasion of Iraq, over 100,000 civilians were killed, what to speak of the numbers that were crippled, and psychologically scared for life. All of this in the name of putting Saddam on trial for killing some 200 rebels. So the question is how many vegetarians would support that kind of invasion, as opposed to meat-eating people.
Obviously the issue of weapons of mass destruction held by Iraq at the time and Saddam’s iron fist tactics in securing his political position were no more than ploys on the part of Bush and his cronies. Let us have a little political upheavel in America and we will see the troops dispatched to eradicate the insurgency. But the question remains as to how much violence will be participated in from any faction by people who don’t consume flesh.